Forum Activity for @Rodney Nikkels

Rodney Nikkels
@Rodney Nikkels
03/19/12 13:12:46
24 posts

World's Rarest Chocolate? Anyone care to weigh in?


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Hi Brian,

Thanks for the clarification!But how do you the cocoa is the "rarest", you haven't tested all others is it? Perhaps genetic pureness is not as rare as you might think ;). Do I understand it right that the cocoa is pure "nacional" in the sense that it is the pure nacional from Ecuador? Was the cocoa introduced from Ecuador into Peru or what is the connection? You have any info about that?

Best and succes with the beans! Chocolate (from your beans) being sold in Holland?

Rodney

brian horsley
@brian horsley
03/19/12 10:33:08
48 posts

World's Rarest Chocolate? Anyone care to weigh in?


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Hi all this is Brian Horsley from Maraon Chocolate. Saw this thread and I thought I would clarify a couple of things. I live in Peru with the farmers full time and am responsible for all aspects of collection, selection and post harvest processing.

We use one heirloom variety of cacao from a number of smallholders in one small valley in northern peru that has been genetically tested as pure Nacional. Our variety is genetically equivalent to the La Gloria and Las Brisas Nacional accessions, what are widely considered to be the "reference" or purest known examples of Nacional cacao. But our cacao, unlike Nacional from Ecuador, has on average 42% white beans, and grows at much higher altitude. Also the climate and terroir is different, with a resulting difference in flavor from what is historically known of Ecuadorian nacional cacao.

As Rodney says, Piura has some populations of all white cacao. So do we in our valley. We don't select for bean whiteness, we select for genetic purity. That is why its so rare, because its the only known genetically pure Nacional cacao, none has been found of this purity anytime recently in Ecuador, and the first genetically tested Nacional found outside of Ecuador. Itis only available from certain farms in one small valley in northern peru.

We have spent a lot of time and effort developing fermenting and drying profiles to take into account the mix of purple and white beans present which present fermenting challenges. I am currently achieving 98% + fermented beans, 0 slaty, 0 off flavors, and almost no vinegar acid due to some techniques which i personally have developed (with assistance from some very experienced cacao/chocolate people) and supervise daily.

We do not claim to make chocolate from pigment free beans, we select for varietal purity and the beans here happen to average over 40% white beans. The remaining 60% have a lot of pink, fairly white beans and some purples too. This diversity tends to give a lot of complexity to our chocolate's flavor profile.

Our Fortunato #4 couverture is not a blend. it is made from pure nacional beans that i personally buy raw, ferment and dry, and send to switzerland, to be mixed with a small amount of cocoa butter and sugar. no lecithin, vanilla, salt or anything else. No beans of any other variety are present. We sell our couverture mostly to high end chocolatiers, although we have pastry chefs among our clients. More information is available at the website. Many of our clients have websites where you can see how it is being sold. Almost none of it is sold as "part of something else", and so I would categorically disagree with Sebastian's comment that it "can't be too remarkable."

Of course taste is subjective, if Sebastian thinks its just "ok" nobody can dispute that. But the reception in the marketplace confirms to us daily that our chocolate is indeed very fine in flavor and presentation.

Thanks for bringing this up Brad, I have always respected your style and honesty on these boards. If anyone has any questions about our cacao or chocolate I can always be reached here, although when I'm in the campo I frequently go for long periods of time without access.

Saludos, Brian

Rodney Nikkels
@Rodney Nikkels
03/18/12 03:30:10
24 posts

World's Rarest Chocolate? Anyone care to weigh in?


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Dear Brad,

I've met Mr Brian some years ago in Piura, where we were organising a workshop with the APPCacao (Asociacion Peruana de Pequenos PRoductores de Cacao) whereby all information about the criollo beans of Peru was presented. He at that time was new into cacao and I guess was interested in the subject and started a program in the Maranon region I assume. Is his cacao the "rarest cacao"? Well, if you use the % white beans it would definitely not be the rarest, around Piura f.e. much higher % white is found, and actually thanks to the work of Cepicafe (a producer coop) farmers are replanting the white criollo since some years.

Best

Rodney Nikkels

Sebastian
@Sebastian
03/16/12 15:10:08
754 posts

World's Rarest Chocolate? Anyone care to weigh in?


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Due to the fashion in which genetics express themselves, there will be variation even within single pods - the impression Maranon would have one believe (at least the impression i'm left with after reading/viewing the marketing materials) is that the chocolate is made from these pigment free beans. The reality is that only a very small % of the beans inside the pod are of this phenotype, the majority of them are phenotypically 'typical' beans. Meaning they express their traits largely as any other bean would be expressed.

I've had this chocolate, and it's ok. There's nothing wrong with it. But it's very clearly a blend to make it commercially feasible - one could separate the beans from the pods to segregate them, however they'd be left with a very, very small pile of white beans. To be honest I expected more, and I've had much better chocolate (some of it from the fine folks who hang out here). But taste is quite the subjective qualitative attribute.

I've never met the folks at Maranon, and know nothing about them. I'm quite sure the beans, even with their phenotypic mixtures, are quite capable of producing a wonderful chocolate. Perhaps their sensory definition of a great chocolate simply differs from mine; or perhaps they're in the process of learning what fermentation and drying protocols are necessary to get the beans to express their flavors differently (i'm sure they're working with a pretty small quantity, so trialing is going to be a slow process). They appear to be selling to high end pastry chefs, which means the chocolate can't be too remarkable, as it will be used as a component of something else, and the more remarkable a given element of a pastry design is, the more difficult it is to incorporate other highlight ingredients. Too remarkable, and it becomes limiting.

I would also note that Dr. Meinhardt is a geneticist, quite knowledgeable as a geneticist, but he's not a chocolate guy, a bean guy, or a post harvest guy. Not to detract from any work he's done; only to point out where his competencies lie. From an industry standpoint, it highlights one of the gaps in terms of how breeders interact with growers, and industry. Breeders, geneticists, farmers, and industry are all motivated differently, and i've yet to see all 4 groups together at the same time to discuss how to best plot a path forward for the future. Why is this a problem? Because if breeders give the farmers something that industry doesn't want (but the farmers do because it's high yielding - but tastes terrible only the farmers don't know this because 99% of them have no idea what chocolate even is) - we're not going to have a sustainable industry.

Brad Churchill
@Brad Churchill
03/16/12 10:15:54
527 posts

World's Rarest Chocolate? Anyone care to weigh in?


Posted in: Tasting Notes

A link to this website was just sent to me. I'd be interested in reading what people think...

http://www.maranonchocolate.com

I look forward to reading your replies.

Brad


updated by @Brad Churchill: 04/10/15 13:53:07
Brad Churchill
@Brad Churchill
03/15/12 18:31:06
527 posts

Fondant & Margarine in a ganache recipe??!!


Posted in: Tasting Notes

I've never seen it, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen! Margarine and Fondant in truffle centers sounds kind of gross actually. Definitely not for me!

Al Garnsworthy
@Al Garnsworthy
03/15/12 17:58:45
22 posts

Fondant & Margarine in a ganache recipe??!!


Posted in: Tasting Notes

Hi, I have recently seen a range of truffles using fondant and margarine in their ingredients list.

I have seen glucose and invert sugar used in making a ganache before, but fondant - I had never heard of using this.

I would imagine the margarine is used to keep the cost down, rather than using butter.

Anyone have any thoughts on using these types of ingredients in a ganache? I was pretty shocked to be honest.


updated by @Al Garnsworthy: 05/02/15 09:53:05
Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
03/21/12 12:27:02
1,696 posts

EQUIPMENT AVAILABLE


Posted in: Allow Me to Introduce Myself

Everyone - posts about equipment for sale or wanted go in CLASSIFIEDS.

Jonathan Simpkins
@Jonathan Simpkins
03/21/12 12:13:20
11 posts

EQUIPMENT AVAILABLE


Posted in: Allow Me to Introduce Myself

Nice, what a beauty! Exactly like that. Is this available? I am interested. What other equipment do you have? Please e-mail me,

newancients001@gmail.com

Brad - I know it is not reasonable to hold out for a victorian era melangeur; however in the future I plan to have one and I figure that I might as well take a shot at finding one now. I am at a pretty beginner level and I have other equipment I am currently using that works fine for my needs, but I can still dream! Btw, Brooklyn Cacao also custom manufactures melangeurs just like the one above. I am still interested in hearing what you can share about more efficient solutions though. :-)

Alan Ian Beverley
@Alan Ian Beverley
03/21/12 02:27:54
8 posts

EQUIPMENT AVAILABLE


Posted in: Allow Me to Introduce Myself

Hi Jonathan

Something like the attachment?

Brad Churchill
@Brad Churchill
03/21/12 01:03:34
527 posts

EQUIPMENT AVAILABLE


Posted in: Allow Me to Introduce Myself

Hi Jonathan;

When I was first getting into the industry, I had a romantic vision of acquiring a large stone melangeur as well, (saw one at Scharffenberger's factory). They are very veryhard to find, but I've heard rumblings that some Italian companies have considered starting to manufacture them again to address the growing artisan market demand.

There are however other more efficient (and lighter) solutions. I can't share everything with you, but I hope this post will help save you time looking for something that you may not find, and allow you to be more productivefocusing on a better solution.

Cheers

Brad

Jonathan Simpkins
@Jonathan Simpkins
03/20/12 23:05:03
11 posts

EQUIPMENT AVAILABLE


Posted in: Allow Me to Introduce Myself

I am interested in large stone melangeurs NOT made by cocoatown or santha. Old, european style melangeurs - not modified wet grinders. Do you have any of these?

Alan Ian Beverley
@Alan Ian Beverley
03/20/12 02:31:44
8 posts

EQUIPMENT AVAILABLE


Posted in: Allow Me to Introduce Myself

Hi Beth

I have a response from you but it is only the letter d is there something that i can help you with? Look forward to hearing from you.

Kind Regards

Alan Ian Beverley
@Alan Ian Beverley
03/15/12 09:37:54
8 posts

EQUIPMENT AVAILABLE


Posted in: Allow Me to Introduce Myself

Good Afternoon Chocolate lovers

i am new to this and so just to keep it short, if you have any confectionery or chocolate equipment requirements, please contact me.

I look forward to hearing from you.


updated by @Alan Ian Beverley: 04/27/15 19:42:14
Felipe Jaramillo F.
@Felipe Jaramillo F.
03/26/12 22:04:29
55 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

Dear Sebastian,

I appreciate how you always come through with a healthy dose of reality.It should've been obvious that if the components had some sort of chocolate taste, it would be possible to have decent artificial flavors.

Either way I am looking to training taste buds through familiarity. Just like a musician learns to recognize the characteristics and sounds of his favorite musicians or tunes. I can't help it but recognize most of the major sax players I've heard in the last 10 years just by listening to a few seconds of a solo. They all have characteristic traits that I've learned to pick.

Familiarity breeds confidence but I understand curiosity gets one into vast territories that will take a lifetime to master.

All the best,

Felipe

Kate Hamilton
@Kate Hamilton
03/26/12 05:48:15
4 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

Looks interesting - cant wait to see the book

Thomas Forbes
@Thomas Forbes
03/25/12 11:35:26
102 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

I would love to see the presentation. Will you advertise when you will do it for public consumption?

Sebastian
@Sebastian
03/25/12 10:52:06
754 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

You're certainly headed in the right direction with that approach, which is why i didn't say anything earlier. The comment was most directed to Felipe's request around getting individual components, which, in my opinion, if one doesn't have a certain level of background understanding of what drives flavor perception in chocolate, isn't going to be very useful - because while that one compound may be present, it may not be perceived very, very differently in it's pure state at a given level than how you perceive it in chocolate. It's a terribly, terribly complex field - some parts of it are fairly well understood, others less so. You're going to have a hard time finding much publicly published; however that doesn't mean the work's not been done 8-) only that it's a closely guarded valuable! I've been doing this for a long time, and there are many things that i understand pretty well. I'm not even going to let the ink dry on that statement before i follow it by saying there's also lots of things that i don't understand very well, which is part of what makes the world of cocoa so exciting - there's always lots to learn! I need to parse my time somewhere here, because i dont have much of it, and as you point out, many of these topics can easily be a lifetime of study for anyone. I need to be somewhat judicious in what areas i get involved with, as i don't want to leave someone 'hanging' by giving a partial response, knowing that i often disappear for long stretches at a time where i simply don't have the physical means to respond, much less the time to do so 8-)

Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
03/25/12 09:52:31
1,696 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

Sebastian -

While I don't make the point in the presentation that some of the chemicals can't be directly experienced, I do make all of the rest of the points, using analogies I learned as an art student about color theory.

The concept is called the "theory of simultaneous contrast," which basically says that any colors next to each other are perceived a particular way. If you change any one of the colors, your perceptions of all of them is going to change. You can change the color itself (shade, tint, and/or hue) and/or you can change the area of color relative to the other colors.

Flavor perception works the same way. It's not just the presence of specific aroma and flavor chemicals, the total quantity and their relative proportion are also important. As you point out, the presence of one aroma chemical and alter the perception of another - the combination is different from each separately. Simultaneous contrast.

More generally to the ChocolateLife community -

All of this is moderated by the way in which aromas and flavors are released in the mouth over time by heat, a process which is in turn moderated by saliva and complicated by the fact that some compounds are water soluble and are encapsulated in fat. And, finally, there are some "tastes" that are actually sensations - astringency is one.

Another point I make in the words that accompany the slides is that each one of these areas is worthy of careers' worth of study. What I am doing is providing an overview that provides a peek at the level of complexity involved.

How does soil micronutrient chemistry affect flavor? We know it does, but I don't know of any credible research that definitively points to the presence (or lack) of a particular nutrient in the soil that leads to the presence of particular chemicals in beans (by what mechanism - uptake, metabolic?) that, when fermented (wild yeast? controlled?) in a particular way (time, temp)will lead to the presence of a particular set of flavor precursor compounds that, when roasted, will result in aroma and flavor compounds that when ground, refined, and conched will lead to a particular flavor being present in the final chocolate.

Sebastian
@Sebastian
03/25/12 05:42:44
754 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

A few points to consider Felipe:

1) Some of the chemicals ID'd in chocolate are not commercially available via food safe production methods

2) Often times, a chemical's flavor will vary by it's concentration. That is, if you have a very little bit of it present, it may taste 'earthy'. if you have that same chemical present at higher concentrations, it may taste 'moldy'.

3) Often times, flavor perception changes with the addition of other chemicals. A chemical that, by it's self, may be perceived as, oh say toasted bread, may when in the presence of other chemicals taste like fruit.

Flavor chemistry in chocolate is very, very complicated. It's one of the reasons there are no good artificial chocolate flavors out there - very few folks know chocolate flavor chemistry well enough to pull it off.

Felipe Jaramillo F.
@Felipe Jaramillo F.
03/24/12 05:11:19
55 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

Clay,

I enjoyed the presentation. Great points, images and solid type work.

One of the points that caught my attention was the breakdown of some aroma/flavor chemicals. I'm dying of curiosity to smell/taste these pure chemicals and train myself to recognize them better.

Have you ever tried the alpha-amyl cinnamyl acetate, some 2,3,5,6-tetramethyl pyrazine or cocoa hexenal directly?Do you know if there's a way of getting a hold of an aroma/flavor kit?

Sarah Amorese
@Sarah Amorese
03/23/12 05:53:23
2 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

Thank-you, Mr Gordon! I am grateful!

Warmest,

Sarah

Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
03/21/12 09:49:44
1,696 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

Sarah:

Thanks for the kind words. I will post the photos here w/ copyright notices embedded in them in the next couple of days.

You (offer open to all ChocolateLife members) are free to use them for classes, with attribution.

They should not be used on a web site, publication, printing for display, or other form of promotion, without seeking my permission first.

Sarah Amorese
@Sarah Amorese
03/21/12 07:23:50
2 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

Mr. Gordon!

This is quite incredible! Once a month, in my shop I give a very, very humble by comparisonpresentationsimilar in concept to this one. How would I go about getting some of these types of photographs to help my visual presentaion?

Did you and Mr. Pollard work together on this?

Wonderful, indeed!

Warmest,

Sarah

Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
03/17/12 15:52:57
1,696 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

Jeff:

This discussion is here to help me decide how to flesh out the book. It takes a lot to go from a two-hour lecture to put something together that really meets the needs of the community. Questions like yours will help me do just that, so I really appreciate them.

One thing to note is that each of the areas covered in the presentation is a career's worth of research, and most of the areas may not actively have any formal research going on. So - I can't tell you what exactly in the soil affects flavor, all I can tell you is that the micronutrient chemistry of the soil, and its microbiology (e.g., rhizome population) can.

Chances are, all cacao that's grown contains some amounts of the two chemicals you mention - how do you change the balance of those, deliberately? I don't think anyone knows the answers to those questions.

I can work to be as specific as possible (which addresses the question of applicability of the information) within the limits of what's known.

:: Clay

Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
03/17/12 15:47:35
1,696 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

Nat:

The picture at the end is me standing next to an "old man of the forest" a wild cacao tree estimated to be at least 300 years old - and still producing. All of those are trunks as the chupons are never cut.

I am not going to release the audio recording as there are audience interactions that are inaudible. However, I will be reviewing the tape and using it as source material for the eBook.

The Maillard reaction are not the same thing as caramelization and people get them confused. Both are non-enyzymatic browning reactions, with the Maillard reaction being between amino acids and reducing sugars, but do not need (high) heat to happen. Caramelization occurs under conditions of pyrolysis (lack of oxygen) at high temperatures.

Cautionary tales - The one about Hershey is about how his original condensing process soured the milk, but because chocolate was then an industrial product and the hallmark of industrial products is repeatability, the company is still reproducing the mistake, over 110 years later.

Why Belgium - asks why Belgium is known for "the best" chocolate. They didn't invent any machinery or process and there is no magical yeast in the air (as there is in SF for sourdough bread). The answer is (probably) ... Campbell Soup Company.

As for the last one - it'll be in the book. And all the rest will be covered in greater detail.

Jeff Nelson
@Jeff Nelson
03/15/12 17:28:48
8 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

Being very new to chocolate, and after looking at your slides, I would want more application of the principles discussed (maybe you cover that in the lecture).

For example, how does the soil/elevation/harvesting/drying specifically affect the chocolate? What would I do to get the flavors I want?

How do I grow beans withalpha-amyl cinnamyl acetate orcocoa hexenal?

If I grew cacao, and someone said, "hey be careful because it affects the flavor," I wouldn't know what to do with that information. But If someone said, "if you continually expose the pods to degrees over 100F, they will begin to develop a strong coffee flavor," then I would be able to apply that.

Those are just things that would interest me.

Nat
@Nat
03/15/12 07:08:50
75 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

Nice presentation Clay! That picture at the end is amazing of the wild (?) cacoa in Beni! Is that all the trunks of the cacao?

Willyou release the audio recording? It'd be interesting to fill in some of the gaps in the slides, e.g.you mention the Maillard reaction at the beginning which is key to understand but I didn't see mention of it later. I betyou described something about it. I'd also like to hear the 3 cautionary tales.

-Nat

____________________________

Nat Bletter, PhD

Chocolate Flavormeister

Madre Chocolate

http://madrechocolate.com

Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
03/15/12 05:51:47
1,696 posts

How Chocolate Gets Its Taste - A Presentation and a Request


Posted in: Chocolate Education

To All ChocolateLife members -

I gave a talk last night to the Experimental Cuisine Collective at NYU. Attached is a PDF of the slides I used for the talk, entitled, "How Chocolate Gets Its Taste."

The idea for the talk was to examine - in as much detail as possible given the time available - the various factors that contribute to flavor development and perception in cacao and chocolate, from the genetics of the bean through terroir, manufacturing, and finally sensory evaluation.

Of course, the slides cover only the high level concepts, there was a lot of additional material presented and a bunch of very interesting questions in follow up (my audio recording runs to about 1h45m).

I am interested in getting feedback and questions as I am considering gathering all the information and self-publishing in various eBook formats.

Interesting idea? Useful? Any topic area you think should be covered (or not)? I'd be happy to explore and answer questions and other areas of interest here in this discussion, though obviously the book will be more organized and focused.

Thanks,
:: Clay


updated by @Clay Gordon: 04/23/15 23:29:28
jessica@graciaschocolate.com
@jessica@graciaschocolate.com
12/09/13 00:01:27
1 posts

Any great tasting raw chocolate?


Posted in: Opinion

Brian,I am with you in that I am not a raw foodie, and am not concerned with the definition of "raw." I do, however, enjoy the flavor. It tastes lighter to me, a little fruitier, and more subtle in flavor.

My preferred raw chocolate bars include LuLu's "Maca Love" bar, LuLu's "Aztec bar," and Fearless Chocolate's "MIdnight" bar. You might also try Sacred Chocolate's "Mylk" bar. It has a much different flavor than what you might expect, but it is worth trying for the experience of it.

Cheers,

Jessica

jessica@graciaschocolate.com
@jessica@graciaschocolate.com
12/08/13 23:49:04
1 posts

Any great tasting raw chocolate?


Posted in: Opinion

Nat,

I would love to understand more about bean-to-bar Raw production. I am curious how you sterilize the beans without roasting. I came across a forum post where Clay talked about potentially using UV lights. What have you found to be effective?

Secondly, Im curious how easy it is to remove the husk without roasting. My understanding is that the husk is loosened through the roasting process. What is your method?

I am super curious about this process and am in the beginning steps towards creating a full picture, so basically any information you want to share, I am open to hearing.

Thanks so much,

Jessica

Nat
@Nat
03/14/12 23:34:38
75 posts

Any great tasting raw chocolate?


Posted in: Opinion

Hi Brian,

The thing is very fewpeople makebean-to-bar "raw"chocolate aside from Pacari, Gnosis on specialLimited Edition Bars, and us occasionally. Don't know if anyone's coming from anywhere in the states, Ecuador, or Hawaii (for ours) where they can find theseto Peru, but at leastyou know know which to aim for.

-Nat

____________________________

Nat Bletter, PhD

Chocolate Flavormeister

Madre Chocolate

http://madrechocolate.com

brian horsley
@brian horsley
03/14/12 22:15:52
48 posts

Any great tasting raw chocolate?


Posted in: Opinion

I'm not a raw foodie, don't care about health benefits, doesn't matter to me how raw is defined, or if its even possible. Just curious if anyone on this board has ever tried any great tasting chocolate that calls itself raw?

Here in Peru there is none available, i've never been able to try any. Anyone willing to comment on flavor/quality of raw brands, or recommend one that i could have someone bring down sometime? Again I don't care if its really "raw". Just seems like unroasted and presumably unconched chocolate would be bitter, astringent, and if the beans are fermented, vinegar-y.

any suggestions?


updated by @brian horsley: 04/12/15 16:23:58
Andy Ciordia
@Andy Ciordia
03/28/12 16:49:33
157 posts

small chocolate climate control display for Fair events?


Posted in: Geek Gear - Cool Tools (Read-Only)

If you bang your head on any market issues let me know, glad to either row with you or maybe explain some ideas around them. 4 years taught us more than I'd ever like to know. ;)

If there is a will there's a way; you have a great product and personality so I expect you'll find a warm reception.

Casey Hickey
@Casey Hickey
03/28/12 13:40:03
7 posts

small chocolate climate control display for Fair events?


Posted in: Geek Gear - Cool Tools (Read-Only)

andy - thanks for the thorough explanation. i see that it is quite a process, but you're really thought it through (and probably learned a lot by doing/mistakes/what ifs). DFM does have electricity, so that might help somewhat. though we'd still need to address the relative humidity issue very carefully. thanks so much for weighing in with your detailed explanation! with our unseasonably warm and early spring, i am very cautious about how we handle the market! cheers.
Andy Ciordia
@Andy Ciordia
03/26/12 19:30:59
157 posts

small chocolate climate control display for Fair events?


Posted in: Geek Gear - Cool Tools (Read-Only)

Oh yea and my knowledge is for those who do not have permanent vending. We've had to vend at day or partial day mainly outdoor with rarely electric. Change the scope to something more friendly and the solutions change.
Andy Ciordia
@Andy Ciordia
03/26/12 19:22:31
157 posts

small chocolate climate control display for Fair events?


Posted in: Geek Gear - Cool Tools (Read-Only)

Casey! Davidson market, sounds like fun. It's always been way too far for us to travel but it's a nice market!Again there is no perfect solution. Everything has tolerance and associated costs.When outdoors you have ambient temps and humidity.Every time you open a holding container, electric or not, you will lose temperature and introduce humidity.Being busy will increase this exchange by a magnitude.No solution will obviate this, and most if not all will only solve the cold rebound. Ie how long it takes to turn to a cold temp.Another axiom you come across is the faster you get the rebound the more water crystals manifest. At least for those of us in humidity belts. You see you trap the humidity then the cold creates a dew point. You can keep your product cold but then keeping it dry becomes your next hurdle. There is always something.So.. What we came up with after taking coolers, freezers, and fridges out--you create a series of containers. No high tech thing needed, no dry ice either--humidity is worse than lack of ultimate chill.Standard freezer packs. Large squares work great. For each cooler pick up 3 or 4.For us in June, 85-95' heat, 70+% humidity we would take 3 to 4 coolers. The lot of product for the day is organized by splitting the contents among the coolers in somewhat even amounts--this can be also axed by items of popularity. Bag your items in their categories, this is assuming your products are already boxed or packaged too. If you are selling individual chocolates, we stopped this but when we did we handeled it similarly. Large tubs replicated. The main goal of bagging is to keep moisture out by giving everything more time. In this model you may breach the container but if you keep additional humidity from other items you can sustain one cooler longer before needing to transfer.Ok so you start the morning in one cooler, that's one cooler that has been breached, only one getting contaminated by air and humidity. The day wears on and you migrate remaining products to next cooler, and onwards as sales or slowing of coolering or increased humidity/liquid becomes a nuisance.Time of year, craziness of weather, all dictate the speed and need to handle things in such an order but you do it a while you find the knack for keeping pristine chocolates and butter ganaches safe all day long.On the flip side my love of winter has grown. In December I need no ice, and can lay all produce out. Makes me so freakin happy. I abhor a July afternoon at a 5'oclock market. Luckily we don't have to do many of those anymore. ;)So! No cords, little clean up, and just freeze your packs again--gtg. I've always wanted something slicker but slicker has a huge cost or a huge weight and both always end up breaking or sucking at some time or another. "Keep it simple stupid" really seems to boomerang me on this one.
Roy Greenhalgh
@Roy Greenhalgh
03/23/12 14:49:47
9 posts

small chocolate climate control display for Fair events?


Posted in: Geek Gear - Cool Tools (Read-Only)

Here is an Update...right from EIC solutions...

Based on the information you provided, without an internal heat load you would require approximately 1500BTUs if the ambient temperature is 100F and you would like the case to be 70F. We have a 1500 BTU unit however it is $2760.00 and it is too large to mount on the size of your case. Our units are not designed for this sort of application. I find a website below that has some blogs about alternative cooling for this sort of application. I hope that you are successful in finding a solution, enjoy your weekend.

...and they linked me here to CL... LOL Well...at least She tried. Good thing I don't have a time limit on this thing.

Roy Greenhalgh
@Roy Greenhalgh
03/20/12 19:31:51
9 posts

small chocolate climate control display for Fair events?


Posted in: Geek Gear - Cool Tools (Read-Only)

LOL Well at least I know I'm thinking in the right line here- I just spent a few days looking into various Coleman and Koolatron coolers and a few cheap wine coolers. Even took a trip today to the local Restaurant Supply shop to check their "Room of broken Dreams" (Used items from Failed Restaurants and shops)

I was toying with the idea of just buying a Koolatron just to see what I have to work with but for about $20USD more I could get one of the wine coolers Cheebs mentioned. I have a lighting contact that can give a nice discount on some LED lighting and light diffusers. So it's just a waiting game for the paycheck to hit before I start. Oh and I need a local Plexi worker. Ugh. I should write this down.

I wish someone would make a Youtube Vid on this. :)

Clay Gordon
@Clay Gordon
03/20/12 18:10:27
1,696 posts

small chocolate climate control display for Fair events?


Posted in: Geek Gear - Cool Tools (Read-Only)

Carlos -

Did you see these? Twine . it wouldn't take much to use the built-in temperature sensor to build an on-off switch to keep the temp regulated within very narrow limits, especially when the units are DC powered.

:: Clay

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